[Kalmed]

I am hope this resourse will answer or at least lead me down the right path to marine redemption. Iam new to MI reefers and I come to you to pose this question.

All my corals died, why?

Here's my system:

- 75 gal up and running X 6 months transfered from a 46 bow.
- 150+lbs. live rock
- 440w 50/50 VHO on 10 hour/day
- 20 gal sump with Euro-Reef CS6-2
- Rio 17 HO for return and circulation
- Rio 14 for tank circulation

Inhabitants:

- Mated pair Maroon Yellow stripe 5y/o
- Blue damsel 9y/o
- Falco Hawk 2y/o
- 200 Blue legs
- 50 Red leg
- 4 Emeralds
- 2 Sally's
- 50 Astrea smails
- Pepermint shrimp x 2
- Coral Banded shrimp X 1

I have been fighting Green Hair algae since starting up. I have made changes to lighting length, increased circulation of H2O to decrease CO2 pockets, Phosorb to decrease to < 1 ppm (or 0 at this point), using RO for H2O changes. I use Seachem- Reef complete and reef plus, Lugoles Iodine, and Marc Weiss products for additives.

One day, all my shrooms died, I removed my candies, frogs and polyps to one of my other tanks to stop the madness. I did a H2O change and let the tank sit no for 4 weeks. I added a shroom back and it died within a day or two. I may add:

- Ammonia -0-
- Nitrates -0-
- Nitrites -0-
- Phosphates - <1 -
- Calcium 420 ppm
- pH - 8.2 -
- Salinity - .25 -
- Temps -78-82-

I know not what to do! HELP!!!

 

[DLBerlin]

Have you tested your iodine level?
The lugols and the reef plus contain Iodine and possibly the weiss products(which ones?). Too much can also cause excessive algea growth.
The salinity is 1.025???

 

[DLBerlin]

Sent reef120 a pm to move this to the proper forum so maybe you can get some help
Debbie

 

[reef120]

Post moved to proper forum.

 

[Jimbob]

Did you get the 75 new, or did you purchase it used? Regardless, I would get a copper kit and test for copper levels in the tank... copper will kill corals.

If it is present, you need to figure out why and take the necessary steps to resolve it.

Also, if there is any chance at all that anything like furniture polish, hand lotion (even just the residual on your hands is too much), or under-arm deoderant (this is one of the worst) somehow got in your system, there could be some chemical pollution going on.

I would suggest testing for the copper, running your protein skimmer a little more on the wet side (cant' remember if you said you had one or not) to remove more stuff for awhile and start running activated carbon, changing it every two weeks at a minimum for awhile to help ensure any chemical pollutants are removed. Adding a Poly-Filter pad for a bit wouldn't hurt either, as it can absorb and remove alot of stuff, including copper and other heavy metals... best of luck and keep us posted.

 

[Kalmed]

I am running a Euro-Reef CS6-2 skimmer full time and have been running a litte wet. The tank was used and was cleaned by my self and had been empty for 3 years. I thought of copper before, but the tank was used for freshwater cichlids and all my inverts are surviving. Iodine my be a possibility, but I didn't add any chemicals for the month I had it empty and running. I will test for both I have nothing to loose. I have been using Reef DNA and Spectra Vital for 2 years with positive results on softs and coraline algae, and yes it smells a little like apple juice.

 

[Mike]

1. did you move all the sand and rock to the new tank from ther old one? are you using a deep sand bed?

2. did you have hair algea in teh old tank?

3. did the tank ever smell like a rotten egg?

4. Was it a sudden overnight crash?

Even though your test kits all say "undetectable" the fact that you are fighting hair algea means there is an abundance of nutrients in the water coloumn for it to grow.

NH4(ammonium) and phosphates are being added and or produced in your system.

How much live rock do you have?

an imbalance can occur with a DSB and excessive live rock. what happens is lots of no3(nitrate) is reduced but then not fully reduced to nitrogen gas and then the bacteria on the rock and in the DSB convery it to NH4 (algeas favorite food)

you could turn off the lights for a week and still come back to hair algea.

I would look at the system as a whole.

Do I have an imbalance in nutrient reduction vs production from DSB and live rock

Are my R/O membranes old

Start changing smaller amounts of carbon weekly

Start using A polyfilter sponge

Start changing water weekly

scrub all the live rock clean and then rinse it

take out the DSB and start over

Hope it helps.

 

[DLBerlin]

HeHe-yeah -what he said!

 

[sean]

Ok, how bad is the hair algae in your tank right now? If its pretty bad i have feeling your phosphates are probably well over 2 or 3 easily. When i had my 180 seutp i had one of the worse hair algae problems ever, i had it covering my glass, my rock, and even my sand, and my phosphates only read 0.03. Because hair algae eats up all the phosphates before you can even see them.

Normally people that have bad hair algae, usually will have a reading of 0, even though hair algaes main source of food is phosphates. So if you have a reading of 1, and bad hair. You probably really have a very dangerous level of phosphates. The may not be the total cause of all the corals deaths, but it could be greatly contributing to it.

Hope i made some sense...

My one other question is do you have bio balls?

 

[Mike]

the poly filter will help remove the phosphates in the system but if you are still in an inbalace between production of phosphate / addition via feeding and reduction / removal the problem will still occur.

do a solid review of live rock, DSB if you have one, maintenace / husbandry practices.

Keep records regarding R/O membrane changes, carbon changes / water changes / feeding including type of foods offered/ and age of lights.

 

[greenb]

I think you got good info above,, but if it comes to this I would make scrubbing the live rock the very last thing on the list to try.

Only because that is one REALLLLLY SUCKKYYY JOB.

When I was battling hair algae I did the following:

1. Shortened the photo-period by a couple of hours.
2. Water Changes, Water Changes, Water Changes. But make
sure you test your new water for phospates. Water changes
won't do any good if your source water has phosphates.
3. Siphon out as much hair algae as possible with every water
change. My trick for this was I attached a micro mesh net to
the end of a 1" hose and put that end in the sump and started
the siphon. This way you can siphon all day long and you won't
lose any water and the algae is collected in the mesh net.

Jusr remember that there is no quick fix. So this process could and most likely will take a few weeks to sort itself out.



As for all the deaths? You need to answer some of the questions mike asked. If they all died in a day then I would lean towards something got in the tank. Cleaning supplies, hand lotion ect....


hth
bob

 

[Mike]

i had this happen before after a vacation. I came home, the tank was bleached out (SPS) the water smeeled horrible. it was due to high temps while I was gone and the person watching the tank did not have the foresight to turn up the airconditioning. thats why I have a programmable thermoostat now!

anyway I tried to do water changes, tried cutting the photoperiod, kept the tank in blackness for a week to no avail!!

finally had to give in and take out the live rock, scrub it rinse it, added activated carbon and 2 poly filters.... in three days not a trace of hair algea!

 

[Kalmed]

1. did you move all the sand and rock to the new tank from ther old one? are you using a deep sand bed?

2. did you have hair algea in teh old tank?

3. did the tank ever smell like a rotten egg?

4. Was it a sudden overnight crash?

OK LEt me see if I can sort this out.

I do not use a substrate at all. I use water current to move waste to the front of the take for easy removal. I know stop shaking your head. I've had my tank this way for 6 years now and upto now I have never had a problem. Iam using 150+ lbs. of live rock a mix of Kalinie and Figi 75 lbs or so from the old tank and the rest new that I skimmed my self for 45 days.

I did have hair algae problem in the old take from time to time never this bad!

The tank has had a strong oder from time to time, much less as I upgraded to the euro-reef skimmer.

Crash was over 2-3 days. I work in a hospital and use alcohol hand wash and H2O rinse before dipping into tank. I am the only one ALLOWED to mess with the tank.

Im not using Bio-balls because I have so much live rock in the system. I was told rock should be enough.

R/O is brand new

I think Ive answered all the questions, so my list of things to do:

- Add filter
- Check RO H2O
- Poss turn off lights

What about Silicate?, I was told this is another part of the hair equasion

 

[DLBerlin]

The RO should be removing the silicate.
New ro?-did you run it awhile and throw out the first 5 gallons of water from it?

 

[Kalmed]

Thats what I thought regarding the R/O, but I was told different by a respected friend in the biz.

R/O H2O is from store system up and running X 2 months, maintained by Candie H2O.

I have done the nasty job of scrubbing rock and rise, counting 3 days ago it is now 4 times. just grows back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Kalmed]

On another note, never used Char. in Na tank. Just put in bag and place in overflow with poly pads?

 

[DLBerlin]

"Thats what I thought regarding the R/O, but I was told different by a respected friend in the biz."
ALL systems I've seen recommend this-nasties in the filters to start with.

"R/O H2O is from store system up and running X 2 months, maintained by Candie H2O."

So you are using store bought ro water? not your own system?

"I have done the nasty job of scrubbing rock and rise, counting 3 days ago it is now 4 times. just grows back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

If thats the case then your water is definately bad. Store bought ro is typically not good quality.

 

[Mike]

silicates typically cause brown diatomic algea. Maybe more circulation around the rock if you are having odors (dead areas?) may be occuring.

 

[Kalmed]

Please let me clarify.

I am using R/O H2O from a reef shop. JD's Fish World to be specific. The system was set up and running X 2 months and has been tested by Candies H20. I just started using R/O in my system in the last month to hopefully decrease my algae problem.

I will be taking my H2O sample to the South-west Michigan aquarium club to do spectrum testing, maybe I'll find some problems with that.


What are your feelings on UV sterilizers? I have heard mixed reviews..................

Thank you to all that have replied, I really appreciate all the help and advice I have received!!!!

 

[DLBerlin]

Okay!
Well then if you were using tap water before then youve got a bad build up of phosphates that would be causing the hair algea. It will just take time and alot of cleaning and water changes to get it out of the system. Not sure if that would have killed the corals but with tap water in general there could have been alot of nasties in there. Debbie